Sonic Forces vs. Mania (Video)

[SomeGuyWithASega]

So, Sonic Forces is getting lots of flack recently for its features (avatar creation, Classic Sonic gameplay) and the demo that had been released in Japan with only one minute of play time. I'm still excited for the game, and these negative comments don't skew my opinion on the game, but they still exist nonetheless.

Due to all this controversy, I made a little video referencing and comparing both Forces, Mania, and the reception and public view of each. It's just a SpongeBob clip with logos and images of the games slapped on the characters, but it's pretty darn accurate.

https://vid.me/7oEr5

If you're confused, here's an explanation: after Forces is booed off-stage for being "weird", confusing and upsetting the audience, Mania goes on and receives roaring applause by the audience for simply mopping the floor--a metaphor for Mania being simply a brand new 2D Classic Sonic title and not much else, which is what the fans wanted. Later, Forces tries to do the same thing, but gets no applause--again, referencing the criticism of Classic's gameplay, and even the inclusion of Classic Sonic at all, which feels redundant to some.

I'm still hopeful for Forces despite all of the backlash; it'll at least be decent from what I've seen. What do you guys think?

[Bob Dobbs]

You asked, so...Boo to Sonic Forces..it should NOT have the same game play as Mania. I miss the epic 3D adventures that made me a Sonic fan. To note, I did not like the pre-Dreamcast era Sonic games at all. It was like Mario bros in high speed and never tempted me to purchase a game console of any kind. I did like Sonic 06 (as it's called) but it still lacked the spirit the original Sonic Team did with SA & SA2 (I know, it's the same argument others say, but this is the first time I have chimed in on a Sonic topic).

A positive note is that I do like that they made a connection between the two games where Sonic from Mania teleports in and attacks Kaos in Forces. I saw this on "Bill Dozer Sonic" 's youtube video channel. He's got a bunch of Sonic videos and feels more like you do, SomeGuy etc... He did said it first, check out the date of the post. This kid seems to have a good insight on things as he is objective and cautious with his presentation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wXtzq1AqL8

[SomeGuyWithASega]

I see your point, but I have to side with the public opinion on the Classic games. They have great controls, awesome and iconic physics, great graphics and sound, as well as excellent level design. This especially goes for S3&K and Mania.

I love Sonic Adventure, but mostly because of, 1) its soundtrack, and 2) it was probably the most 2D-feeling 3D Sonic game we ever got. It was fresh and new, yet still brought back memories of the originals. Its level design was based around going fast, but it let you roam free most of the time and explore your surroundings; and be rewarded for it.

I don't really like SA2 because of this and other reasons. Most of the Sonic/Shadow stages are incredibly linear and lack a sense of exploration (except for Final Rush), Tails/Eggman's stages are neutered with clunky controls and cheap enemy placement, especially Tails' stages, and Knuckles/Rouge's stages have been made longer and more frustrating with the new radar and the maps being enormous compared to SA1's.

I liked Knuckles' explorative stages in SA1, for the stages being fairly easy to navigate through (except you Sky Deck), yet making it challenging to get the Emerald piece. I also liked the idea of characters traveling through other characters' stages; for example, Sonic could race through the end of Speed Highway, then Knuckles could go through and, using his extra abilities, uncover hidden secrets that Sonic could remember to pick up next time going through. But yeah, both of these things are absent in SA2.

I did like Generations, as well as Unleashed, from what I've played of it (Wii version, and first level of PS3 version before I gave it away ), but they all don't bring the same magic that SA1 had. If Sonic Team made a new 3D Sonic game like SA1, with explorative level design and free-roaming aspects (and Chao of course), I'd probably get it. But as it stands, I probably won't get Forces. It looks cool, but it's obviously not gonna get good reviews from IGN, GameSpot, or any "professional" game reviewers.

[Bob Dobbs]

Point taken, thank you for presenting this topic! To note, my son wants both games as he is a big Sonic fan, so I will be watching him play it at X-mas time (he's getting a new console from Santa Claus, sadly a Pretendo Switch).

[SomeGuyWithASega]

Nice. About Nintendo(n't), as much as I don't like some of their decisions recently (DMCA policies against fan games), I still like them more than Sony or Microsoft in terms of game consoles (I'll have to think of a nickname for them). Mainly because they're not trying so hard to be edgy and cool that it kinda falls flat, and they're doing a sizeable amount of innovation with the Switch.

I just have a bitter hatred of Sony because they're the bad type of gaming juggernaut; the kind that cheats in console wars by fitting a DVD player in the system, ruling over and even near-killing competitors (Nintendo, Sega), then leeches off the success of the previous system to make the new one sell. The last couple generation wars were not very exciting--you always know, not matter what, Sony will come on top.

First, they got lucky with the PS1. Sega had made terrible mistakes leading to the quick death of the Saturn, and Nintendon't was disgusted at the feud with Sony a few years ago with the SNES CD, leading to them sticking to cartridges with the next-gen system, which backfired on them big time. With the 6th generation, Sony leeched off the success of the PS1 and included a DVD player in the next system, the PS2. The price was $300, making it the cheapest DVD player on the market that doubled as a game console. With the inclusion of the DVD player, Sony had everyone beat by catering to other markets. Thus, the Dreamcast died and ended Sega's first-party run, as well as outselling the XBox and GameCube by a long shot.

With the PS3, Sony made a huge mistake in designing it at first, which was beefing it up to the point where they had to make the price lower than what it was to produce it. After a few years though, Sony refined it and removed some features to make it cheaper to produce and buy. The result was the PS3 Slim, and sales of the PS3 skyrocketed to almost exceed the competition. The 360 sold only 4 million more, and Nintendon't's Wii sold about 20 million more because of similar practices that Sony did with the PS2; catering to the casual crowd to make more money.

And today, the PS4 is still winning in terms of total sales, but the Switch is catching up in terms of sales over a period of time, not total sales (the thing just came out several months ago).