DualStick + CDZ Button DC Controls

[Roareye]

GAMES THAT WOULD BENEFIT FROM A SECOND STICK AND ADDITIONAL BUTTON CONTROLS

TITLE - Genre - Current Layout, Custom Layout (Modded/Needs Modding)
----------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------
COMPLETE
QUAKE III ARENA - First Person Shooter - Fully Modifiable,, Just needs a controller that can access all MAPLE functions
----------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------
NEED MODDING
ARMY MEN: SARGE'S HEROES - Third Person Shooter
STICK: Move/Turn, RT+STICK: Strafe
LSTICK: Move/Strafe, RSTICK: Turn, RT: Fire
----------------------------------------------------------
BLUE STINGER - Third Person Shooter
STICK: Move/Turn, LT+STICK: Look
LSTICK: Move/Turn, RSTICK: Look
----------------------------------------------------------
CYBER TROOPERS: VIRTUAL ON - Mech Shooter
...
... (May be compatible due to Twin Sticks?)
----------------------------------------------------------
DRACONUS: CULT OF THE WYRM - Third Person RPG
STICK: Move, LT+RT+STICK: Look, LT/RT: Strafe
LSTICK: Move Forward/Back+Strafe, RSTICK: Look/Turn
----------------------------------------------------------
FUR FIGHTERS - Third Person Shooter
STICK: Look & Turn, ABXY: Strafe & Move, DPAD: Weapons
LSTICK: Strafe & Move, RSTICK: Look & Turn, ABXY: Weapons
----------------------------------------------------------
HALF LIFE - First Person Shooter
STICK: Look, ABXY: Move/Strafe, DPAD: Jump/Light/Crouch/Use, LT+DPAD: Alt Fire/Reload/Previous+Next Weapons
LSTICK: Move/Strafe, RSTICK: Look, LT: Alt Fire, ABCDXYZ: Jump/Light/Crouch/Use/Reload/ Previous+Next Weapons

HALF LIFE: BLUE SHIFT - First Person Shooter
STICK: Look, ABXY: Move/Strafe, DPAD: Jump/Light/Crouch/Use, LT+DPAD: Alt Fire/Reload/Previous+Next Weapons
LSTICK: Move/Strafe, RSTICK: Look, LT: Alt Fire, ABCDXYZ: Jump/Light/Crouch/Use/Reload/ Previous+Next Weapons

HALF LIFE: COUNTER-STRIKE - First Person Shooter
STICK: Look, ABXY: Move/Strafe, DPAD: Jump/Light/Crouch/Use, LT+DPAD: Alt Fire/Reload/Previous+Next Weapons
LSTICK: Move/Strafe, RSTICK: Look, LT: Alt Fire, ABCDXYZ: Jump/Light/Crouch/Use/Reload/ Previous+Next Weapons

HALF LIFE: OPPOSING FORCES - First Person Shooter
STICK: Look, ABXY: Move/Strafe, DPAD: Jump/Light/Crouch/Use, LT+DPAD: Alt Fire/Reload/Previous+Next Weapons
LSTICK: Move/Strafe, RSTICK: Look, LT: Alt Fire, ABCDXYZ: Jump/Light/Crouch/Use/Reload/ Previous+Next Weapons

HIDDEN AND DANGEROUS - First Person Shooter - STICK: Look, ABXY: Move/Strafe, DPAD: Controls, LT: Jump, LT+DPAD L/R: Select Soldier , LSTICK: Move/Strafe, RSTICK: Look, ABXY: Controls, DPAD L/R: Select Soldier
----------------------------------------------------------
KISS PSYCHO CIRCUS - First Person Shooter
STICK: Look/Turn, ABXY: Move/Strafe, DPAD: Use/Crouch/Weapons Select
LSTICK: Move/Strafe, RSTICK: Look/Turn, ABCXY: Use/Jump/Crouch/Weapons Select
----------------------------------------------------------
MAGFORCE RACING - Racing
STICK: Turn, XB: Drift, D-UP: Unlock Engine
LSTICK: Turn, RSTICK: Drift, X: Unlocks Engine

MAKEN X - First Person Shooter
STICK: Turn, Move F/B, LT+STICK: Look U/D, RT+STICK: Strafe
LSTICK: Strafe, Move U/D, RSTICK: Turn, Look U/D

MAX STEEL - Third Person Shooter
STICK: Move/Turn (Tank Controls)
LSTICK: Move/Turn, RSTICK: Turn (Easier Movement)

MDK 2 - Third Person Shooter
STICK: Look U/D & Turn, ABXY: Move & Strafe, DPAD: Items
LSTICK: Move & Strafe, RSTICK: Look & Turn, ABXY: Items
----------------------------------------------------------
OMIKRON: THE NOMAD SOUL - Third Person Shooter
DPAD: Move & Turn, LT&RT: Strafe
LSTICK: Move & Turn, RSTICK/LT&RT: Strafe

OUTRIGGER - First Person Shooter
DPAD: Move, STICK: Look, LT&RT: Turn
LSTICK: Move, RSTICK: Look, RT: Fire, LT: Jump
---------------------------------------------------------[/color]
PHANTASY STAR ONLINE - Third Person RPG
STICK: Move, DPAD: Menu Controls, RT+A/B/X: Secondary Functions
LSTICK: Move, RSTICK: Menu Controls, DPAD: Menu Controls, C/D/Z: Secondary Functions

PRINCE OF PERSIA: ARABIAN NIGHTS - Third Person Adventure
STICK: Move, LT+DPAD: Look
LSTICK: Move, RSTICK: Look
-----------------------------------------------------------
RED DOG - Third Person Shooter
STICK: Look, RT: Forward, LT: Back, D-UP/DOWN: Change Camera, A: Fire, X: Shield
LSTICK: Forward/Back, RSTICK: Look, RT: Fire, LT: Shield
----------------------------------------------------------
SHENMUE - Third Person Adventure
STICK: Look, D-PAD: Move
LSTICK: Move, DPAD: Move, RSTICK: Look

SHENMUE II - Third Person Adventure
STICK: Look, D-PAD: Move
LSTICK: Move, DPAD: Move, RSTICK: Look

SLAVE ZERO - Third Person Shooter
STICK: Turn & Look, ABXY: Strafe & Move, DPAD: Controls
LSTICK: Strafe & Move, RSTICK: Turn & Look, ABXY: Controls

SOLDIER OF FORTUNE - First Person Shooter
STICK: Look, ABXY: Move & Strafe, DPAD: Controls
LSTICK: Move & Strafe, RSTICK: Look, ABXY: Controls

SPAWN: IN THE DEMON'S HAND - Third Person Brawler
STICK: Nothing, DPAD: Move
LSTICK: Move

SPEC OPS 2: OMEGA SQUAD - First Person Shooter
STICK: Look/Turn, ABXY: Move/Strafe, DPAD: Controls
LSTICK: Move/Strafe, RSTICK: Look/Turn, ABXY: Controls
----------------------------------------------------------
TOM CLANCY'S RAINBOW SIX - First Person Shooter
STICK: Look/Turn, ABXY: Strafe/Move, LT+DPAD DOWN: Crouch, DPAD UP+ A/Y: Climb, DPAD UP: Interact, LT: Increase Speed
LSTICK: Strafe/Move, RSTICK: Look/Turn, ABCDXYZ: Controls

TOM CLANCY'S RAINBOW SIX: ROGUE SPEAR - First Person Shooter
STICK: Look/Turn, ABCDXYZ: Strafe/Move, LT+DPAD DOWN: Crouch, DPAD UP+ A/Y: Climb, DPAD UP: Interact, LT: Increase Speed
LSTICK: Strafe/Move, RSTICK: Look/Turn, ABXY: Controls

TOMB RAIDER: CHRONICLES - Third Person Adventure
HOLD LT: Look, LT: Change Target
RSTICK: Look/Change Target

TOMB RAIDER: THE LAST REVELATION - Third Person Adventure
HOLD LT: Look
RSTICK: Look

TOY COMMANDER - Third Person Shooter
STICK: Look/Turn, LT: Brake, RT: Forward, A: Machine Gun, B: Special Weapon
LSTICK: Forward/Brake, RSTICK: Look/Turn, LT: Special Weapon, RT: Machine Gun, C(Left Shoulder): Switch Special Weapon, Z (Right Shoulder): Switch Vehicle
----------------------------------------------------------
UNREAL TOURNAMENT - First Person Shooter
RSTICK: Available, CZD BUTTONS: MAY NEED MODDING IN
CZD BUTTONS: Made Available (Right MAPLE Stick available, CDZ buttons unknown)

URBAN CHAOS - Third Person Shooter
DPAD: Walk/Move Camera
RSTICK: Walk/Move Camera
----------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------

ORIGINAL POST;
Have there been any updates on this? I've been through their Twitter and found nothing, so that may answer my question, but it's been literally dead silent for about 10 months now.

Kinda disappointed in their initial moulds, which lacked a secondary thumbstick. Retro Fighters' controller lacked this option too - which I understood was because they were focussing on 2D fighters and not any other genre (Might also explain why others have noted some sensitivity issues with the BrawlerDC thumbstick - specifically in regards to graffiti inputs on Jet Set/Grind Radio).

The first moulds of the Retro-Bit DC controller seemed a bit redundant - essentially a bog standard DC controller with two additional face buttons (I assume additional L+R triggers routed to the face buttons). This would again make it a 2D fighting controller, which means we would simply have two controllers for one specific genre. The wireless functionality will be good, I have the Retro-Bit Mega Drive and Saturn controllers with 2.4Ghz wireless and they are fantastic, but it's hard to splurge £50 on a product that doesn't fix one of the fundamental flaws of the DC controller design. While the DC maple bus supports a legit second stick (Which would be useful for homebrew specifically) I'd even take a mimic of the ABXY buttons to make games like Quake III and Fur Fighters so much easier to play without resorting to the full keyboard+mouse setup.

Adam Koralik did a video reviewing the BrawlerDC and he had an interesting idea. Where the BrawlerDC has a Turbo button (again, for 2D fighters) he suggested a button that switches the thumbstick and d-pad functions to make games such as Shenmue (which move on d-pad) play in a more accessible fashion. Such an idea could also be used on a secondary thumbstick, pushing a button to swap the stick between an ABXY clone and a maple-bus accessible secondary stick. This would give the controller much more use across a wider variety of games. BrawlerDC caters to a single market and ignores the rest, and that is fine. I'm just hoping Retro-Bit can make a controller for the rest of us so that we can choose how we play.

Any news or updates anywhere on this thing?

[Anthony817]

https://www.obscuregamers.com/threads/r ... -look.477/

I spoke to them over the summer, they told me Covid really put a damper on their plans and pushed back development indefinitely. Also there was a thread about this controller on the forums already. I even posted about the status of them on the 28th of last month.

https://www.dreamcast-talk.com/forum/vi ... =2&t=11812

Anyways, they are fully updating the controller for DC with Saturn D-Pad and 6 face buttons, PS4 thumb stick as well as repositioned triggers.







About dual analog, we already spoke to them informing that the Dreamcast's Maple protocol can support 2 analog inputs. They also have prototypes for dual analog wireless Mega Drive/Genesis and Saturn controllers but they have not been released yet. My hunch is they will do similar for the DC too once the initial wired version and wireless ones with the same layout as their wired ones is out first.







Don't worry, they are going to release them eventually but they just wanted to get them right first, and then Covid really set them back even further than they already were.

You can see my tweet about lack of updates here.

https://twitter.com/Anthony_817/status/ ... 8294030336

I have been following this intently since CES 2018 when the products were first announced. So I am as eager to get my hand on an updated DC controller with dual analogs just as much as the next person. But we just have to be a bit more patient for hopefully not too much longer.

[Roareye]

Thanks Anthony. Sorry, I didn't realise there was a pre-existing topic. My bad.

I am still interested in this project. 2.4Ghz wireless is a major plus since no cabled controllers reach my sofa (I'd need a roughly 3-5 meter long cable to make the distance), and the controller cable extenders I have can be a bit iffy. If they make it in the same semi-transparent blue as their MD/SAT controllers then that'll match my other controllers from them.

Just feels like a wasted opportunity to even bother releasing the DC controller without a second stick. With the Mega Drive and Saturn it makes sense, because it keeps it more or less authentic and there's literally zero use of a second stick for those consoles (FPS titles etc in the way we know them weren't a thing. Doom etc would barely benefit). But the DC came out in the console generation that defined the second thumbstick, had native support for it and has many games that really do suffer it's loss.
Adding another stick won't make it any less authentic than adding the C and Z buttons, and would save them production costs down the line.

Unless the one-stick version is about £25, I'll likely skip it and wait the dual-stick variant. I have 4 one-stick DC controllers already and £50 is too much to pay for a controller without it.

[Anthony817]

All good mate hehe. I agree about no reason to make regular wired single stick ones, but many people want it and don't care to have to hack games executables to enable remapped controls. I was speaking to the dev of the Sonic Z-treme homebrew for Saturn and he said it also allows 2nd stick inputs in the controller protocol, so he could natively support it in his homebrews or even hack it in for retail games for that matter.

Also, I THINK but could be wrong as don't own any but doesn't Retro-Bit allow for different layouts for controller configs in the controller firmwares already, so you could emulate the face buttons on a right stick if you wanted, or swap around left and right stick? But I think doing it on the game executable will be the best way to remap games and perhaps release updated packs of games with the hacks already enabled, or patches for people to do to own discs. Taking games from dubcity's updated GDRom set of games with full size game cover art updated and optimized to remove dummy file all GDI's have that keeps them at 1.1GB would be best to use simply because already look nice in GDEMU and Dreamshell.

[megavolt85]

Anyways, they are fully updating the controller for DC with Saturn D-Pad and 6 face buttons, PS4 thumb stick as well as repositioned triggers.

they will have to implement a mode change by pressing hot buttons, otherwise their venture will fail

[cloofoofoo]

Anyways, they are fully updating the controller for DC with Saturn D-Pad and 6 face buttons, PS4 thumb stick as well as repositioned triggers.

they will have to implement a mode change by pressing hot buttons, otherwise their venture will fail

Whys that

[Anthony817]

Anyways, they are fully updating the controller for DC with Saturn D-Pad and 6 face buttons, PS4 thumb stick as well as repositioned triggers.

they will have to implement a mode change by pressing hot buttons, otherwise their venture will fail

Well, the point of the dual analog controllers was first to be used natively on PS3, PC and other more modern systems. Being able to use them on the original consoles were just a nice side perk. They do already have hot key presets for the other wireless controllers they make, and it will most likely be the same on these as well. So I don't understand what exactly you are saying? But they did confirm those wireless dongles for the Saturn were confirmed to support practically all modern controllers already. However not sure how they will get those official Xbox and Sony controllers to have hot key settings unless they can handle it from the dongle firmware?

Pretty sure they will also make this the case for the Dreamcast controller dongle as well.



https://twitter.com/RetroBitGaming/stat ... _&ref_url=

[megavolt85]

Whys that

because there is no universal configuration for all games
if you do not switch the mode, the joystick in some games will be correctly detected, and in some it will be impossible to change the control settings
there is even a game in which you cannot press the start button on the title screen
I did not just change modes in my adapter, I have already gone through this path of trial and error

[Anthony817]

Yes, but why not go in and hex edit the games for better controls? I thought that was the whole point of wanting dual analogs so people could hack the games to have a truly more modern layout scheme? Sure it would be more work in the end, but it would truly make the games way more comfortable to play. There is an awesome modern control layout mod somebody made for Quake 2 on PSX, and I enjoy playing that version of the game way more now with it able to use the modern FPS control scheme.

[megavolt85]

Yes, but why not go in and hex edit the games for better controls?

joystick manufacturers are clearly not interested in this